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Series/rim size chart
Mouthpiece comparison charts
Contrabass and Tuba
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Some messages I have received through the years:
I've been on the XT SN104, D, D3 for about 3 hours now, playing on that Olds Superstar (Recording). I've gone through my usual long warmup, and an hours worth of lip slurs and now just took a break from etudes. Just excellent! Lip slurs just happen now with so little effort this will take me some time to get use to! Notes just happen now! The tone on this old Olds I've got has never been fuller either. Also never has this horn responded so effortlessly. Heck, to top it off I wasn't even interested in improving anything on this small bore because I like the sound of larger bore. The Olds is just being put to use until the large bore arrives, can't wait to see what I can do on the large bore!!! I am going to have to retrain my embouchure to not work so hard, that's about the only way I can put this.
I surely thank you for your advice in the past and these mouthpieces now.
-SW (Oct 2006)
Wow Doug. I am totally in love with this G5 shank. For me, I noticed a difference between it and the 4 right away on my euph (Yamaha 321). I felt that the 5 really helped me put more air through the horn and gave me a stronger sense of stability in the upper registers. It seemed like I would overshoot many notes on the 4. I guess I put a lot of air through the horn.
Your design time was well worth it. This shank made my euph a completely different horn. It really allows me to play with more stability because I feel it plays "down the center" of the pitch more accurately. Again, thanks for the mouthpiece. I really appreciate it.
-RK (October 2006)
... the MT99/C/C2 is working out great on my 2b. I just had to commit to the bigger rim and it is working. I haven't lost endurance with bigger rim, I've gained it along with better tone and accuracy. I don't do the embouchure shift down low anymore. Wow! If I had only known this before..........Thanks again.
-LS (October 2006)
Just thought I'd write and thank you for sending over that 101N rim. I have been using it for over a month now and am absolutely delighted with the results. It's just what I've been looking for. Thanks also for your advice in Birmingham about keeping the mouthpiece higher up. That too has made a positive difference and I feel generally more confident about my playing.
Many thanks once again.
-KH (December 2006)
I was really impressed with the immediate effect such a small change from the 101 to the 102 has made. I have seen your posts on this subject on the OTJ which got me thinking. I had moved to the 101 about a month and a half ago after trying too hard to squeeze my chops into a an 11C sized piece and playing heavy lead on tour for a long time. I lost some of my high range with the bigger stuff for a short while but it's coming back 2 fold, (popped out a very strong double high Bb today) used to be an unusable thin squeak!!!!
Thanks Doug :-)
-CF (January 2007)
The mouthpiece arrived today and holy crap what a difference. See, my Dennis Wick 4bs has a HUGE cup for a lead bone player, but I have learned to manage and can now play a 3 hour big band gig (but that is pushing it). After playing 4 hours today in ensembles plus 2 hours of practice I'm ready to do another 6 hours, and on top of that, my articulation and especially my fluidility is astronomically better. That small cup made a difference. I'm not going to switch out any cups for now but I am going to be at ETW this year and if you have a stand, could I even try some smaller cups and just swap out my cup with another if I can manage a smaller one? (while maintaining my tone and essentials of course) Just a thought (let me know my options) but I am extremely happy right now. Ready to break this mouthpiece in on a BB gig tonight.
-AS (January 2011)
I am just emailing to thank you for the mouthpiece. It responds VERY well and I am enjoying it so much. Thanks!=
-JR (March 2011)
I just wanted to send you a quick note of thanks. I've been using your pieces for several years now, and I've always marveled that with your system, I can go from my bass to a small tenor or large bore tenor with just simple adjustments to my airstream (always using the same 113 rim).I've done a lot of "legit" bass trombone playing with the M/M9 on my Edward 454, dual bore. The set up provides a great deal of sound density that pushes through a professional level wind ensemble with 5 horns, 7 trumpets, 2 euphs, and 3 tubas like a Peterbilt (and with only 3 trombone players, that is pretty much an necessity).
Last night I sat in with a big band that I hadn't played with in a couple of years.
I swapped out the M/M9 with your K/K9 and boy was it fun. Just enough sizzle and bite while maintaining a big Edwards sound and density. I had forgotten that the horn could do that.
So again, thanks for making a great product.
-MS (May 2011)
I had my first opportunity to try out the hybrid mouthpiece on Friday, after returning from abroad, The result was much better than I had expected, it sounded better than either mouthpiece on their own, and oddly, corrected a couple of iffy-intonation notes outright that neither the PT65 or DW3 did on their own. So I used it for a pro gig on Saturday and I got a lot of compliments on my sound and people asking what I had done to achieve that...
So thank you very much for your help on this one a resounding success!
With kind regards,
-ON (May 2011)
Hi Doug-just want to say thanks-the MB 108 Icup I8 backbore is really working well. I've used it in every musical situation in my freelance life here in NYC. I've spent years and TOO much money trying to find something a touch bigger than a 1&1/2 G. Now I've found it-everything is easier-with nothing sacrificed.
All the best,
-DH (May 2011)
Doug Elliott wrote: Firm the area below your corners. Not AT the corners, BELOW them. That automatically firms the lower lip and uses the correct muscles.
Reply: I've been working with this idea in the last couple of weeks since you posted it. Not to put too fine a point on it, this may be the most useful piece of advice on any subject I've ever read on the Internet. I am amazed at how much difference this makes in the sound coming out of the tuba.
-TubeNet, (June 2011)
YES!! I love it [E8 shank]. I used it on an Idina Menzel gig with orchestra where the parts varied from orchestral to commercial, and it was just what the doctor ordered.
Still loving the 100/C3 stuff too. The larger version (LT) works great on my 6H and yamaha .508, and the smaller version (MT) works shockingly well on the 2B+. I'm leaving that setup at my show right now and the trumpet player asked if I had switched to larger equipment. I guess compatibility is key.
I hope all's well,
-DL (June 2011)
Thanks for the time you spent with me yesterday. You really simplified something that, to me, was so complicated I never figured it out. Now I have something to practice for. These charts will be on my stand every day. Hope whatever mouthpiece we eventually decide works best for me will be just a formality down the road, once I get more used to the routine you've prescribed. This is going ro be an exciting process.
-RS (June 2011)
I remembered why I had this "stigma" against smaller mouthpieces. My teacher heard me play a smaller mouthpiece and didn't like that I was missing the "meat" of my sound. Well this thing so far makes it all easier. The tone is more clearer like people are saying and I seem to have a more "classic" bass trombone sound. It's not a bad thing but pretty cool. I'll just have to suck it up and realize we are all different and this is MY size.
Thank you for working with me and helping me find the righteous path to a sound concept and more importantly feel for my set up.
I want to thank you again for working with me on what time you had with setting up that bass mouthpiece. It makes playing easier than I thought a mouthpiece would of. Thanks!
Hi Doug, just received the mp's.
At a first try it's amazing what a full sound and projection, espc the K, gives... In my opinion it's not difficult at all to play the high notes, and the low sound is really superb... bigger cup, heavier outside and the shank 9 really works well with the besson prestige euph.. I will be back in 6 to 8 weeks, that's a promise.
thanks, this is realy a hit
-PD (July 2011)
The trombone choir rehearsal last night went quite well, with only six players (4 tenor, 2 bass) it was the kind of playing situation I don't often find myself in - exposed, independent, and not as loud as normal. As I expected, the warmup period showed the weakest aspects of my playing,
but working on all the buzzing I did this week helped. There was much less "flinching" of my chops when the mpc made contact and on the attacks. I will definitely continue a significant buzzing schedule for the time being. I am also being very careful of motion in the upper range (no stress up to g', and leaving the notes above alone for a while). Friday's lesson underscored at least for me the importance of followup - refine, revise, revisit concepts and procedures after initial presentation. These people that think one session will do it (even if it is three hours!) are setting themselves up for problems down the road, in my opinion.
-EC (August 2011)
Hi Doug -
I got them today. Great, great great mouthpiece. For me at least, it really is about the rim size and diameter and the LT99 is just perfect. The C cup practically plays itself, it's so easy and quick to respond. The C+ is interesting and I can see I will want that for certain things, so I am thinking I'll keep both. I should be set now for the forseeable future. Thanks again for making such a great product.
-RM November 2011)
Hi Doug --
Playing the mouthpiece all week; you are definitely right, there is no need to change down to a (smaller) rim, I see the point now of your WHOLE system --
-DD (November 2011)
Been playing on this EUPH piece for about a week; I'll say, you've done it again -- Thanks SO much -
It's been an expensive and long process, but I finally have a stable of mouthpieces for my 3 main horns and Euphonium that I can jump back and forth on with ease; without feeling like I need to be "working" exclusively on the instrument for a few days prior to a rehearsal or performance so that I'll "be in shape" for that particular instrument.
Yesterday for example I practiced on the bass, played a Big band rehearsal with my small bore and came home and worked for a few minutes with my symphonic horn; and all felt reasonably like I had been playing that horn all day.
Now, you want my mouthpiece collection? At last count, I had 14 of them all lined up on the table in my practice room in the basement; someone should open a mouthpiece "thrift shop" -- Bach, Wick, Schilke, Marcinkiewicz; some good ones there, all going to collect dust now
-D (November 2011)
After having played your mouthpiece for a couple of weeks, I have to say it is quite fantastic! It is far superior to the Bach I was currently playing; and several professors have already commented on an improved sound. I would like to thank you for taking the time to help pick out a mouthpiece to fit me, and I will definitely be contacting you a bit later to order the 104 rim as you recommended, though only when I feel I've finally gotten used to the 103 and have finally played all of the Bach away. Thanks again for an epic mouthpiece!
-JR (December 2011)
So Doug, I am starting to really benefit from this warm up. Calling it a warm up isn't the right name for it, but who cares really. It's more like a weight lifting session with proper form being the goal. In any case, I am beginning to experience the benefits of playing the entire range on one set. So my high D feels about like my A on top of the staff used to feel like.
I am quite comfortable playing in the low part of my upper register for hours on end with no fatigue. In fact I did a 3 hour session the other day with (name deleted) who made several comments about getting tired and I couldn't relate because I rarely have endurance problems anymore (within my playable range that is).
I know I'm on the right track because I am more comfortable in the mid to low-upper register and dread playing the 4th book now. It's more like, "oh shit, more low notes...". I played 2nd last week and loved it. I've been reading much better too because I am set for everything and don't have to move anything other than my eyes as I read.
It's important to note that right before our lesson I switched to a Bobby Shew Marceinkowicz (sp?) #2 and have been playing it exclusively for two months now. I couldn't make it through one gig on this piece previously. It's like this new warm up routine has forced my chops into the right position and now it's so much easier to play everything on this piece. We shall see what I actually sound like once this CD we just did comes out. Hopefully my sound will be full, relaxed and in tune because that's what I felt like during the session.
Thanks Doug and I'm gonna keep doing the warm up until I can get the double C working everyday. I can get the the A everyday but beyond that it's hit and miss. Thanks for the help, it's making a big difference :)
Regards, BC [trumpet] (January 2012)
I came home after driving my daughter home, tired did not want to practise. My wife checked the mail box, and there it was, my packet of mouthpieces! All three felt like wonders, I even love my euphonium, the 500 bore (gonna use in a jazz gig tomorrow) feels wonderful!
I am happy! The B 42 is not against my will anymore, feels like I never will have any problem swiching horns any more.
Thank you Doug!
-SL (April 2012)
I've been playing a 103 rim J cup and J9 shank for the last week on my Geneva Symphony and I have to say its the best mouthpiece I've played so far. I used to play a 4al, the DE setup gives me the same singing qualities but a warmer and even more resonant sound. I am truely amazed by this mouthpiece. The rim feels extremely comfortable too. I'll be sticking with this one for a while.....
-TM (July 2012)
I've played the lexan n104s on my tenors and alto so far through practice and rehearsals and all I can say is wow, so far I love everything about them.
Everything is centering better and locking in mote easily it feels like. More ring to true sound sometimes too, and it doesn't feel like I've lost any control or anything - feels a little better lower so far. It feels more comfortable too, like it doesn't really "hurt" at all after a lot of playing. Not sure if "hurt" is the right word.
I haven't got to try the bass one out yet but I'm hoping to test it on one of my friends basses tomorrow night.
So far I don't think I ever want to not play on these new rims, is it possible to return my old silver n103?
-MS (January 3013)
Hey I got the F, F8 today. F for fantastic! It's surprising how with a shallow cup, it still sounds pretty warm, and the clarity and ease of playing is great. I believe this was the setup you originally recommended to me a year or two ago. Back then I didn't like it but now I think it's great . Thanks.
-JC January 2013)
Doug, I wanted to thank you for your help choosing one of your mouthpieces. I got a LB110 K K9 and love the way it feels. Everything focuses better, I think my tone has more fundamental and my range has increased both up and down. When I play it, I feel like I am cheating! Anyway, thanks for the help, you make a great mouthpiece.
-TK (March 2013)
I got the piece this afternoon. You're a genius. This piece has a bigger sound on the King than the 1 1/2G Bach. The best part is when I pick up my Williams and play on my 100C, my chops feel great.
I can't thank you enough.
Best, JP (March 2013)
I want to thank you again for taking the time to come in early Friday morning at ETW for a lesson. The adjustment you made to my playing angles, the insight of the proper way to buzz, along with the mouthpiece you set me up with have immediately resulted in a marked improvement in my playing. I've also noticed the partials are lining up and locking in much better, I guess as a result of playing to the "core" of each. Many thanks again.
-DB (March 2013)
I was happy to receive my new Doug Elliot N cup and shank tuba mouthpiece parts on Friday. I installed my 130 rim on it and tried it out; was very pleased with the result. It is a nice complement to my other mouthpieces for the mid and high registers.
Thanks for your advice and fast turnaround time.
-PK March 2013)
I'm a bit late but I like to inform you that the two rims (XT N 103 and 104) arrived on Saturday August, 10th.
I was away with an orchestra for the last week and so I could start testing the rims not until last Monday when I came back home. This is really a pity, because I'm totally amazed by the results I get with the largest (XT N 104) rim !!!
It makes everything so much easier: I have a full, open sound in all registers and the sound is still clear. I can slur from low to high and I donÂ´t feel restricted while playing in the high register. It already starts soaring. Moreover I can play much softer and even quiet entrances seem to be no problem anymore - this was a big issue for me with other mouthpieces. I think I could write a lot more, but there is no need because you definitely know which difference the "right" mouthpiece makes...
IÂ´m looking forward playing the mouthpiece this weekend extensively and to find out more of the positive effects.
I`ll keep you informed and possibly there a some question I need to ask later.
-JB (August 2013)
I really like your gear, Doug. It makes a trombone sound like a trombone. Vibrant sounds -- a healthy balance of core and overtones. And easy to color.
I just felt they need to share after practicing with my DE and Greg Black pieces side-by-side. I prefer your piece.
-JJ (November 2013)
I sent a check to you for the full amount. I'm gonna keep everything so that I have options. The big band gig on Monday was the real test.. Wow. Your craftsmanship is unbelievable. The openness of the 3 shank is perfect. Absolutely perfect. It is exactly what I needed and the cup? Holy shit. Like riding in a Cadillac. It's that comfortable. My face also thanks you. haha..
You da man. I really appreciate you lending me your advice and expertise. There's a reason I came to you first!!
All the best,
-WF (November 2013)
I have got the pieces and i am very happy with them!
I am sorry i didnt go to you earlier, they are exactly what i was looking for, much more core and ease of play, even on the N cup. Now i want to order more:
-JL (January 2014)
Still want to say thank you for the help, that does that i can work as a trombonist today. I could never have done that without you. I owe you so much :)
Hope all is well!
-CE (January 2014)
The mouthpiece arrived today. It looks and feels great, and is quite easy to play. Thanks again for providing a superior product and quick service!
-DP (January 2014)
I received the mouthpieces a while ago and I am happy to report that they are phenomenal.
-MK (March 2014)
I wanted to drop you a quick note to say thank you for making great mouthpieces. I had the opportunity to play in a musical pit last week on a bass trombone/tuba doubling book. I used 126 rim/T cup combo that I bought last fall on a Cerveny tuba and my 113/M combo on my Edwards bass trombone. I was amazed how easy it was switching between instruments (sometimes in just a few quick measures). I don't play tuba that often, but your mouthpieces definitely helped to make a nice tone with easy articulation any a great range of dynamics. I had several music educators (who know I'm a trombone player, primarily) complement me on my "tuba chops". Now if only me fingers were as good as my sound..... oh, well, something to work on I guess. Thanks again.
-MS (March 2014)
[Retapered Bach 6-1/2A to Olds taper]
I received the mouthpieces today and couldn't be happier with the very fine work you did. I honestly wasn't sure what to expect, and the new two tone appearance looks really good. Makes it easy to spot my Olds mouthpieces too. Thank you
-RP (April 2014)
I received the mouthpieces 10 days ago and I am very happy with them. I particularly liked the LT101 H-H8 and H-H9. I won't exaggerate if I say that these are the best mouthpieces I have played on in the last 20 years. Well done Doug. I would like to order also a gold rim LT G101.
-RM (April 2014)
Hallo Doug: I'm writting to tell you I've just to received my order, and the tenor mouthpiece is absolutely perfect for me, you were right, cup G works really well and 108 rim is very comfortable. Now, I'm ready to be able to play as tenor trombone; thank you very very much!!!!
-FM (June 2014)
Hey Doug... Just wanted to tell you that I am really loving this mouthpiece. I did some recording with it and it is so much clearer and more vibrant than my other pieces. I really enjoy it. Looking forward to getting that plastic rim as well. Let me know if you do an H cup for the SB series. Thanks again for your time and making damn good stuff!
-BJ (November 2014)
I have tried every mpc under the sun and haven't found any that outplay yours. I even tried a _______ which is as you know a very expensive and "hyped up" piece of equipment. Now I'm trying to sell it and hopefully get some of my money back. Your mpcs do everything that _______ says his mpcs do. -DC (December 2014)
Hi. Just wanted to let you know that the mouthpiece you recommended for me is doing exactly what I hoped. Every time I play it it seems to get better. Thanks for knowing what I needed and for the beautiful workmanship. -JT (December 2014)
Wow, that was fast, I received your package already yesterday.
It's surprising what a few tens of a mm can make a difference. Lip slurs seem easier, sound is right. Over all I can concentrate much more on making music.
The mouthpiece for bass trumpet is not at all too shallow. The general sound is about the same as the Bach 15E. Only the core is a little bit bigger and more flugel horn or trombone like. Every thing else is way better: lip slurs, bending notes to the right pitch, overall intonation, articulations. The only exception would be if I have to play for a extended period of time above high Bb, the 15E causes less fatigue. -LW (January 2015)
Knowledge and expertise. Top-notch! -JC (January 2015)
[LB 114, E, E3] Really like the cup and shank. Had my first rehearsal with it last night. Worked well. Kind of amazed that a big rim works that well with a smaller cup. It's great. Thank you -DB (January 2015)
[3 years after a series of lessons to correct an embouchure breakdown]
I am happy to report that my playing continues to improve and that - after about four years since this first started - I feel like I am able to play as I used to. I've ramped up my practicing a lot more this season and things have worked their way back...well, perhaps to a new and improved situation, but playing feels good again and I can do the crazy pyrotechnics that I used to do, my sound keeps opening up, and the basics keep getting better. -PP (March 2015)
I'm ecstatic right now because things are working that have NEVER worked before. I'm going to give myself some credit because I have never given up. I have always felt that success was so close. The difference between success and failure has eluded me. If I had never had great days I may have given up a long time ago. It was the great days that kept me in the game. Ultimately I can't explain it but I know it would not have happened without your guidance. -JW (March 2015)
It has been two months since the lesson.
I have been working on everything you showed me, and have seen MUCH improvement. I am far more relaxed playing, more endurance, more power with less effort from low F to high D.
A side effect, I have NEVER had such an easy high range. This has taken a bit, but all of a sudden Eb and F are much easier. Now, I am still figuring out the low range, but it is better. -MB (April 2015)
I've played the new XT 106, C+ cup mouthpiece for a few weeks now on my 36H alto. That "Alto S" shank is definitely the answer to a lot of the headaches that I've had with that particular instrument. Slotting is great, and the partials line up a lot more consistently (ie, I no longer am pulling F4 way in for 3rd, etc).
The tone was even better than I expected for such a large rim. It's a big sound, but still sounds like an alto! The C+ cup is probably the reason for this. In any case, the rim allowed me to switch from tenor to alto effortlessly at the end of a series of long shows for the piccolo solo in Stars and Stripes.
I've also tried the D3 shank with the same piece on my 3B. Plays even better than the alto and it was only an afterthought! You knew my order as soon as I told you the instruments I needed it for. This mouthpiece is not going anywhere!
I am already considering the XT106 rim in gold plate, as the lexan (while nice) is the only thing that I even notice when switching instruments mid-set.
Thanks, Doug! -HR (June 2015)
I have been playing on a Conn Helleberg on the Besson EEb Tuba, primarily within British Brass Bands but also with a bit of brass 5tet, tuba choir and orchestra.
(TU Lexan N130, Rc, RFAm)
I have to say - it's fantastic. I tried it in my home as soon as it arrived, blew a couple of notes, and laughed - the sound was warm and rich, and so easy to produce. I worried that coming off the sharp helleberg rim that my articulation might suffer a bit, but, if anything, this mouthpiece is more articulate, especially in the low register. I tried it in championship section Brass Band concert with me on principal EEb Tuba on Saturday night, and thought that maybe a mouthpiece that sounded so good in small living room might not project in a large hall - I couldn't have been more wrong. I got through a demanding two hour set with energy to spare, and the ease of playing of this mouthpiece was a surprise to me. Lots of fast runs, highs, lows, solos, section playing with the other tubas, blending with other sections of the band, playing jazz, classical, light music - everything seemed a lot more effortless than with my previous equipment. This afternoon, I did an outdoors traditional jazz concert, and everything just popped out - I found that I was being more inventive with my bass lines due to not worrying about things 'not working. This evening, I was at another top section brass band rehearsal, this time playing the top BBb tuba part. Again, I thought that if it works so well for EEb, maybe it'll be a little 'lightweight' for BBb. Not an issue. All night, powered through with a good rich sound and again, the thing I noticed was not having to work so hard.
I hope you realise from this how happy I am with the mouthpiece and the service. It's been great.
Doug, thanks again. Your work is brilliant. -DS (June 2015)
Thank you so much for the lesson. Everything seems much easier already. My accuracy up top has improved dramatically. I can't believe that my playing and confidence could possibly improve so quickly. I might be on a high, but it also seems to have improved my articulation!
I'll be in touch soon for another lesson. -KH (November 2015)
I'm extremely happy with the personalized attention I received from Doug. I'm not only getting a mouthpiece, but I also received valuable information about my playing. -LM (December 2015)
If you can possibly get a Skype lesson with Doug Elliott, I highly recommend it, before you change mouthpieces. I had one lesson with him, just a couple of weeks ago. Within about fifteen minutes he had me playing both lower and higher register with much more ease and flexibility than before. My wife, a flute player, was astonished at how open my sound had become, virtually overnight.. -JT (TTF post, December 2015)
Thank you for the lesson. This morning's practice session was very different; it's like you turned on a light for me.
Rochut's sounded better, more musical, and I even played a couple in alto clef on my tenor and it sounded decent.
Obviously I've got a lot of work ahead, but wow. What a difference!
I'll be back in touch in a few months to investigate mouthpiece options.
Thanks again! -SR (February 2016)
I'm using in my bass trombone Bach 50B3LO, one mouthpiece
LB S116,M,M9, and, in my contrabasstrombone BBb Mirafone 54F (double slide) and my cimbasso Ferdinand Roth BBb two mouthpieces CB 122, N, N9 and 124 P, P9.
All are very nice moutpieces, fantastic!!!, Thanks, thanks, thanks!!!. -EL, Buenos Aires Symphonic. (June 2016)
Your experience with mouthpieces and embouchure was invaluable, your choice of mouthpiece gave me exactly what I asked for and more. I wholeheartedly thank you for your time and patience in helping me select the right combination. -EK, Western Australia (May 2017)